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Old 08-07-2009, 06:11 AM   #21
apfejes
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Hi Steven,

If you're going to post a link to a survey, could you at least tell us who will be collecting the data? I'd like to know if that's a corporate survey or just for your own entertainment.

Thanks,

Anthony
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Old 08-07-2009, 07:15 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apfejes View Post
Hi Steven,

If you're going to post a link to a survey, could you at least tell us who will be collecting the data? I'd like to know if that's a corporate survey or just for your own entertainment.

Thanks,

Anthony
Heh, I just asked him the same thing in his other thread about the survey. Methinks there's more than meets the eye here.
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Old 08-07-2009, 12:44 PM   #23
steven
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Hi,
Sorry for the lack of context, I did not want to post a long text again. I have to admit that entertainment is not the only interest I have in next generation sequencing. There's scientific curiosity too (as for everyone here). More information is available in my previous post.
Maybe it would be better like this:
DISCLAIMER 1: This survey may be used for commercial purpose (pretty much like any other information in this forum I think).
DISCLAIMER 2: As I am not planning to prevent people from academic institutes to access the results, it may be used for non commercial purpose too.
DISCLAIMER 3: It can only be used if people do fill it!
So please have a look, it is very short, and hopefully entertaining! Listen to your scientific curiosity...
Anyway, thanks for any feedback.
s.
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Old 08-07-2009, 12:57 PM   #24
apfejes
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Hi steven,

I think, in general, people just object to collecting information when we don't know who will end up using it and for what purpose.

The fact that you're clearly doing this and intend to use the information to help you with your current position at an undisclosed company makes it that much less transparent. Since most of us are academics or work in an academic-related environment, we expect people dealing with us to be as transparent about their goals as possible.

I appreciate your reply - but I don't think I'll be taking your survey any time soon, anyhow.
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Old 08-07-2009, 06:06 PM   #25
steven
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apfejes View Post
I think, in general, people just object to collecting information when we don't know who will end up using it and for what purpose.

The fact that you're clearly doing this and intend to use the information to help you with your current position at an undisclosed company makes it that much less transparent. Since most of us are academics or work in an academic-related environment, we expect people dealing with us to be as transparent about their goals as possible.
Hi Anthony,
Please note that from my first post I have been more transparent about my goals than probably 95% of the people here. That is precisely because I no longer work (exclusively) in the public domain that I felt I had to precise my intentions. It would have been so much easier for me to say something like "Hey, we are grad students working on a practical summer project with a biotech, please help!" (shorter and more efficient -not mentioning that on top of that, we sometimes happen to have students doing exactly this kind of marketing training, so that could perfectly happen). Now if you really want to know my name and my company I can tell you offline, as I said I am not here to sell/advertise. Plus it would allow you to check my -modest- publication record, mainly dedicated to academic research.
Anyway, I totally understand your reaction... I would probably have the same! Except that I would have given a try to the survey of course
My point is that I believe/hope there is a need for good software that could be used by biologists with no computational skills. And I also believe/hope there is still a gap between the available commercial solutions and the current needs. And I also believe/hope that there is another market for a bioinfo software company than to only rely on selling huge and expensive products to a few customers like big pharmas, as it was earlier said in this thread I think (maybe I am just being naive).
So, I made this survey to improve all the above (including naivety).
To conclude about my personal motivation, as a researcher, my goal is simple: help increase human knowledge... even if "so does the shore of our ignorance", to quote Wheeler's paraphrase of your Aristotle signature.
Sorry for the length of my posts.
Yours,
s.

Last edited by steven; 08-08-2009 at 12:18 AM. Reason: (remove excessive linking)
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Old 08-07-2009, 10:21 PM   #26
apfejes
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Hi Steven,

I hope you didn't take my response personally, as it wasn't intended to cause offense. However, I would like to rebut a few of your points.

First of all, I think 95% of the people here are clear and honest about their affiliations, and I would (perhaps naively) think that their goals are also relatively clear. We are all in the game of getting answers as quickly as we can - and beating our fellow researchers, but I would like to believe that we are also a community.

If you had lied and told us that you were a grad student, I don't think it would have furthered your cause - your survey is clearly commercial in nature, and most of us here are well versed in sorting out the "wheat from the chaff."

Finally, I think I'd like to point out that I'm also in the business of providing good software to biologists with little or no computational skills - however I'm trying to do so as a community effort, rather than commercial. In the grand scheme of things, however, one might ask as to which of us is really doing it to "help increase human knowledge?" The project that is done as a commercial venture, or the project that's done as a open community effort?

I'll leave your point about there being a market for a bioinformatic tool kit alone, only to point out that I've provided my thoughts on that point on my blog and elsewhere in the forum, if you're inclined to discuss that further.

Anyhow, I think my main point stands, as long as I don't know who it is that will be looking at the results of your survey, I'm disinclined to participate. Other scientists may feel differently, and that is their choice. I'm simply using the forum to engage in discussion - and I appreciate your continuation of the same!

Anthony
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:44 AM   #27
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Anthony,
no offense. I actually find the discussion interesting, and I hope more people do. For once I'll be brief: I try to believe that I am still helping scientific research, although working in a private company. More here.
Regarding the survey, preliminary results are already available here!
cheers,
s.
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